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Paul Adams (CPO of Intercom)26 October 2023

What AI means for your product strategy

5Frameworks
15Insights

Episode overview

Lenny Rachitsky interviews Intercom CPO Paul Adams about treating generative AI as a foundational product-strategy shift rather than a feature to bolt onto existing software. Adams explains how Intercom reconsidered its strategy from first principles, built Fin for AI-first customer support, and expanded its machine-learning capability while teaching broader product teams to work with AI. He also discusses lessons from failures at Google and Facebook and shares practical frameworks for product-market-story fit, differentiation versus table stakes, pendulum swings, and Jobs to Be Done.

Key ideas

  • Start with the core problem a product solves, then map that work against what AI can already do and may soon do.
  • Distinguish between AI replacement, where software performs the work itself, and augmentation, where it helps people perform the work.
  • Intercom responded to ChatGPT by revisiting its strategy from first principles and making Fin an AI-first line of customer-support defense.
  • AI expertise should not remain isolated in a bolt-on team: invest in machine-learning specialists while enabling general product teams to build on shared foundations.
  • Fast, early, frequent shipping supports learning from ambitious bets, but teams must continually manage the tension with quality.
  • Roadmaps should balance customer-attracting differentiation with table-stakes capabilities required for adoption and switching.
  • Product success requires fit among the market, the product, and a clear story that explains why the product matters.
  • When correcting an undesirable organizational or product state, watch for overcorrection as the pendulum swings.

Transcript available · source text is retained privately and is not published

Frameworks in this episode

People & resources mentioned

Attributed to the moment in the episode. Timestamps are approximate.

People · 16

  • Paul AdamsMentionsIntercom's chief product officer and author of a book about AI and customer service.

    Paul is Chief product officer at intercom a role that he's held for over 10 years

  • Lenny RachitskyMentionstoday we've got another very special compilation episode something I've been pulling on more and more with the podcast and the newsletter

    my guest is Paul Adams

  • Mark ZuckerbergMentionsit was sort of a random decision for Mark Zuckerberg to move from a uh monthly active to a daily active

    the year prior zck had been intervie he was the speaker

  • Eoghan McCabeMentionsIntercom founder and CEO who returned to lead its transformation into an AI-first company centered on Fin.

    Owen and I knew ow and two the co-founders of intercom

  • Brian CheskyMentionsBrian chesky at Airbnb there was a whole article where we unpacked this moment in their product development cycle

    I think at Facebook zck and also everyb B Brian did this

  • Fergal ReidMentionsfergo who who's our head of machine learning

    we have like fergo who who's our head of machine learning

  • Sam AltmanMentionsthere's everybody has uh and had and continues to have like such deep trust in in Sam and Greg and our leadership team

    Sam Alman who's the you know found of head of open AI said hey

  • Mark ZuckerbergMentionsit was sort of a random decision for Mark Zuckerberg to move from a uh monthly active to a daily active

    I don't know if you saw zck talked to Lex Freedman

  • Lex FridmanMentionsthis reminds me of a story I just listened to on Lex Friedman's podcast

    I don't know if you saw zck talked to Lex Freedman

  • Matt RickardRecommendsmentioned

    Matt Rickard is one guy um who who talks a lot about AI

  • Des TraynorMentionsIntercom co-founder who alerted McCabe to the AI team's early product and is writing a book about AI disruption.

    the strong Buy in from you know you know co-founder and CEO Dez

  • April DunfordMentionsApril Dunford was on this podcast and she has this book that she put out recently called the sales pitch

    we had April Dunford on the podcast very recently talking a lot about that

  • Shreyas DoshiMentionsHe reflects on roughly 20 years in product work and leadership roles at Google, Twitter, and Stripe.

    we had uh Shri AR Krish on on the podcast

  • Bob MoestaMentionsBob is the co-creator of the job is to beone framework and worked alongside Klay Christensen for many years

    like we worked with Bob West uh you know who who Who's um age years ago

  • Ray DalioCoinedRay dalio had this passage in one of his books

    the second book I recommend to everyone and buy for people and give to was principles by Ray doio

  • Paul ArdenCoinedPaul Arden who who was worked in advertising a long time ago

    it's a book by Paul Arden who who was worked in advertising a long time ago

Resources · 48

  • IntercomMentionscompany · Intercom

    Paul is Chief product officer at intercom

  • FacebookMentionscompany · Meta

    prior to this role he was Global head of brand design at Facebook

  • DysonMentionscompany · James Dyson

    a product designer at Dyson

  • GoogleMentionscompany · Google

    a user researcher at Google

  • EppoMentionssoftware · Eppo

    EPO is a Next Generation AB testing and feature management platform

  • HexMentionssoftware · Hex Technologies

    this episode is brought to you by hex

  • San FranciscoMentionsplace

    based in San Francisco I did a lot of talks for Facebook internally and externally

  • Cannes Lions International Festival of CreativityMentionsevent

    Facebook had a keynote slot always have a keynote slot at can the world's biggest advertising festival

  • GoogleMentionscompany · Google

    Google then later Google Plus

  • Google BuzzMentionssoftware · Google

    I worked on a lot of failed social projects like you mentioned Google Buzz

  • Google MapsRecommendssoftware · Google

    Google were building Google Maps uh incredible product one of my favorite products

  • AndroidMentionssoftware · Google

    they bu were building Android

  • WhatsAppMentionssoftware · Meta

    I kind of look back now and go like WhatsApp

  • iMessageMentionssoftware · Apple

    or like it maybe like IM message if everyone's on Apple

  • ChatGPTUsessoftware · OpenAI

    if you don't have chat GPT if you don't have like a kind of I can't remember if it's a pro license

  • GPT-4 with VisionRecommendssoftware · OpenAI

    you got to try it you just got to try it

  • IntercomUsescompany · Intercom

    we literally ripped up our strategy almost entirely and started again

  • FinCoinedproduct · Intercom

    built a product called Finn

  • AnthropicUsescompany

    we played with you know other llms like and Tropic and so on

  • Black MirrorMentionstv show · Charlie Brooker

    there's actually a Black Mirror episode with that same premise

  • Mission: ImpossibleMentionsfilm

    I can't remember maybe it's in Mission Impossible where it can take a voice translate it

  • Minority ReportMentionsfilm · Steven Spielberg

    it is like the think minity report

  • ClaudeMentionssoftware · Anthropic

    what an Tropic provide and you know CLA is like they they provide like amazing an amazing technology

  • OpenAIMentionscompany

    what I open AI provide um what an Tropic provide

  • TwitterUseswebsite · Twitter

    I'm on Twitter which is not called X course uh a lot

  • OpenAI BlogRecommendswebsite · OpenAI

    open AI have a pretty good blog um and they write papers and summarize

  • BardUsessoftware · Google

    I'll try other things like Bard you know for example

  • RewindUsessoftware · Rewind AI

    rewind is another like fascinating company

  • HelpBarMentionssoftware · Chameleon

    this episode is brought to you by help bar by chameleon

  • ChameleonCoinedcompany

    this episode is brought to you by help bar by chameleon

  • TableauMentionssoftware · Salesforce

    for example reporting software you know Tableau or you know any kind of reporting product

  • Google WaveMentionssoftware · Google

    Google wave was an amazingly Innovative product that no one really cared about

  • SalesforceMentionscompany · Salesforce

    service now service Cloud Salesforce sendes like Decades of table stake feature building

  • ServiceNowMentionscompany

    service now service Cloud Salesforce sendes like Decades of table stake feature building

  • ZendeskMentionssoftware · Zendesk

    people just buy us alongside service cloud or zendesk

  • Service CloudMentionssoftware · Salesforce

    people just buy us alongside service cloud or zendesk

  • RdioMentionscompany · Rdio

    the Spotify competitor back in the day people were like what was the name of it AIO

  • SpotifyMentionssoftware · Spotify

    Spotify and AIO had the same Market they were solving the same set of problems

  • It's Not How Good You Are, It's How Good You Want to BeRecommendsbook · Paul Arden

    the two books I recommend to everyone always I've copies in my office here uh it's not how good you are

  • PrinciplesRecommendsbook · Ray Dalio

    the second book I recommend to everyone and buy for people and give to was principles by Ray doio

  • The BearRecommendstv show · Christopher Storer

    most recent is the bear which I came to late

  • RewindRecommendssoftware · Rewind AI

    it's just like augmented memory it's kind of like again kind of mind-blowing

  • GPT-4 with VisionMentionssoftware · OpenAI

    I think Chach PT vision is mind-blowing

  • DublinMentionsplace

    you wake up in Dublin to a San Francisco email

  • The 7 Habits of Highly Effective PeopleMentionsbook · Stephen R. Covey

    the second one I think I learned first from um Seven Habits of Highly Effective People

  • GuinnessRecommendsproduct · Guinness

    can I cheat and say Guinness that food absolutely the Guinness in Ireland

  • IrelandRecommendsplace

    the Guinness in Ireland is much much better for a whole bunch of reasons

  • Lenny's PodcastMentionspodcast · Lenny Rachitsky

    you can find all past episodes or learn more about the show at Lenny podcast.com

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Insights & moments

The myth-busts, hot takes, explainers, and tools worth keeping.

Hot Take· 4

Hot Take15:30

AI Is a Meteor Coming Toward You — Bigger Than Mobile

Adams describes people splitting into two camps on AI: those who are all-in and see it as a technology shift bigger than mobile and maybe bigger than the internet, and skeptics who dismiss it as hype like crypto, web3 or the metaverse. He places himself firmly in the all-in camp and says even new releases like ChatGPT Vision blow his mind while we're still scratching the surface.

  • He wakes up thinking about AI every day since ChatGPT launched (Nov 29)
  • One camp is all-in, viewing AI as bigger than mobile — maybe bigger than the internet
  • The other camp sees hype-cycle repetition of crypto, web3 and the metaverse
  • He references the hype-then-trough-of-disillusionment curve as where many skeptics sit

This is a like meteor coming towards you like this is you know bigger than mobile as a kind of Technology shift as big as…

Paul Adams · 16:00
#ai#hype-cycle#technology-shift#opinion
Hot Take31:00

AI Is Already Better Than a Radiologist — and That Could Be a Good Thing

Adams points out that becoming a radiologist in Ireland takes seven years of training, yet AI already appears better at reading X-rays because it can ingest and synthesize every X-ray ever made — something no human can. He argues the job doesn't disappear but fundamentally changes to checking AI's output and bedside manner, and could help clear Ireland's long hospital waiting lists.

  • Radiology takes ~7 years of training in Ireland
  • AI can ingest and synthesize every X-ray ever made, which no human can
  • The job shifts from analyzing scans to verifying AI and patient bedside manner
  • This could be positive given long hospital and X-ray waiting lists

It's seven years training to like learn that learn that skill so seven you be radiologist and then you kind of just into the job…

Paul Adams · 31:30
#ai#healthcare#jobs#opinion
Hot Take32:00

AI Voice and Face Cloning Could Create a Digital Afterlife

Adams calls voice cloning the craziest capability he's seen — AI can copy your voice almost indistinguishably, and combined with 3D face modeling (as in Zuckerberg's metaverse demo with Lex Fridman) it can replicate a real person. He speculates AI could ingest everything someone said and did so that after they die you could still talk to them — an unsettling 'afterlife' that echoes a Black Mirror episode.

  • AI can copy a voice almost indistinguishably from the real person
  • Face-modeling tech (per the Zuckerberg/Lex Fridman metaverse demo) is close to photorealistic
  • Combined, voice and face are nearly indistinguishable from a real person
  • AI could replicate a deceased person so relatives can still talk to them — he notes a Black Mirror episode with the same premise that didn't end well

AI will be able to ingest all the things people say and do and when people die it'll be able to replicate that person you…

Paul Adams · 33:00
#ai#voice-cloning#ethics#future
Hot Take49:30

Don't Panic About AI Job Losses — It Plays Out Through Attrition

Adams cautions leaders against fear-mongering about headcount (e.g. announcing 'we only need two engineers per team'). He cites studies showing people don't tend to lose jobs so much as have roles moved around, and notes customer support is high-attrition — so 'a bot will take everyone's job' more realistically plays out as roles simply not being backfilled.

  • Don't walk around declaring you need fewer engineers per team — it's not how it plays out
  • Studies show jobs get moved around rather than eliminated wholesale
  • Customer support is a high-attrition role
  • AI-driven reduction more likely happens via attrition (people quit and aren't backfilled) than mass layoffs

loads of great studies over the years about how people don't end up losing jobs um the jobs get moved around

Paul Adams · 50:00
#ai#jobs#customer-support#leadership

Story· 5

Story04:30

Freezing On Stage During a Cannes Keynote — and Surviving It

Paul Adams recounts giving Facebook's keynote at Cannes, the world's biggest advertising festival, a few minutes into a talk he'd rehearsed word-for-word. He froze, had a panic attack, and walked off stage still miked up while the crowd laughed. He managed to walk back out and finish, and the takeaway is that even the worst public-speaking nightmare can work out and isn't as big a deal as it feels.

  • He was asked to do Facebook's Cannes keynote the year after Zuckerberg got a hard time on privacy
  • It was the first talk he'd ever rehearsed word-for-word rather than ad-libbing from talking points
  • He froze, walked off stage miked up, then recovered and finished the talk successfully
  • Ever since, he carries a tiny doubt before every talk but believes you have to adapt when life throws curveballs

and um I just froze I I couldn't remember what I was supposed to say uh it was the first ever time in my life…

Paul Adams · 05:30

I had some version of a panic attack I walked off stage I was still miked up

Paul Adams · 05:30
#public-speaking#failure#career#resilience
Story08:00

Why Google's Social Projects Failed: They Came From Fear

Reflecting on his four years at Google working on Buzz and Google Plus, Adams argues the projects failed because they were motivated by competitive fear of Facebook rather than a genuine desire to solve people's problems. He contrasts this with the great products Google was building at the same time, like Maps and Android, and says the experience taught him how not to lead.

  • Google feared Facebook as an existential threat; Facebook thought it could build a social ad unit to eat Google's revenue
  • Google Buzz and Google Plus came from a place of fear, not from trying to make a great product for people
  • Meanwhile Google was building Maps and Android — products Adams considers among the best ever made
  • Fear-driven projects, in his view, don't lead to good things

motivation for those projects came from a place of fear you know it didn't come from a place of Let's Make a great product for…

Paul Adams · 08:30
#google#product-strategy#leadership#failure
Story09:30

The Research at Google That Basically Predicted WhatsApp

As a UX researcher at Google, Adams smuggled formative research into tactical usability studies, mapping out dozens of people's entire social networks over roughly 18 months. The same pattern emerged every single time: people needed far better ways to communicate with small groups of family and friends — obvious in hindsight (WhatsApp, iMessage) but not at the time.

  • He'd add 20 minutes of open-ended research onto assigned usability studies
  • He mapped people's family, friends and communication channels with dozens of people over ~18 months
  • The consistent finding: people need better ways to communicate with small groups
  • The insight was made public via a conference talk, which is what got Facebook's attention

the same pattern emerged every single time which was people need way better ways to communicate with small groups of family and friends

Paul Adams · 10:00
#user-research#google#product-insight#communication
Story11:30

Treated Like a Spy: Leaving Google Plus Mid-Build for Facebook

Adams left Google halfway through the confidential Google Plus project to join Facebook, walking out with all the plans in his head. Some colleagues saw him as a traitor; when he announced his departure Google quarantined him and forensically analyzed his laptop, assuming he was a spy. He traces the internal antagonism back to the project being run from a place of competitive fear.

  • Google Plus was highly confidential — staff worked in a separate building with a different key card
  • Leaving mid-project meant walking to 'the enemy' with the plans in his head
  • Google quarantined him and forensically analyzed his laptop, assuming he was a spy
  • He again attributes the intensity to the project being driven by competitive fear

when I left uh Google kind of assumed that I was one of the spies you know I was quarantined I told them I was…

Paul Adams · 12:00
#google#facebook#career#corporate-culture
Story23:30

Intercom Ripped Up Its Strategy From First Principles for AI

Adams describes ChatGPT's launch as a 'before/after moment' where Intercom tore up its strategy almost entirely and started again from first principles around why people use it — customer support. Sam Altman soon named customer service as one of the first industries to be disrupted, validating a 'bet the farm' pivot that produced Intercom's AI product, Finn.

  • Intercom's head of ML flagged ChatGPT's launch as the before/after moment
  • They rebuilt strategy from first principles around their core: customer support
  • Sam Altman publicly named customer service as an early industry to be disrupted
  • The pivot was a 'bet the farm' mindset that led to building Finn

there was before and that is after and like everything has changed so we literally ripped up our strategy almost entirely and started again like…

Paul Adams · 24:00

one of the first Industries that's going to be disrupted as customer service

Paul Adams · 24:30
#intercom#ai#product-strategy#customer-support

Tool· 1

Tool74:00

The Reference-Call Question a Candidate Can't Dodge

Adams shares a hiring technique he was given for reference calls: since referees are always the candidate's favorite people and best colleagues, ask 'what feedback will I be giving this person in their first performance review?' It's enlightening because there's always a real answer and the referee can't dodge it.

  • Referees are inevitably the candidate's best past colleagues and favorite managers
  • The question: what feedback will I be giving this person in their first performance review?
  • It works because the person can't dodge it — there's always a genuine answer
  • He credits the question to a former colleague, Alyssa

so this question is what feedback will I be giving this person in their first performance review it's an amazing question because the person can't…

Paul Adams · 74:30
#hiring#interviewing#management#tool

Takeaway· 5

Takeaway17:30

You Just Have to Make the Time to Try AI

For busy people who feel they don't have time to go deep on AI, Adams says there's no shortcut — it's about priorities, not crazy hours. Set aside dedicated time to read and actually play with the tools (like ChatGPT and GPT-4 Vision), or it'll pass you by, the same way the mobile wave left slower companies behind.

  • It's about priorities, not working crazy hours (he thinks beyond ~50 hours/week you make bad decisions)
  • Reading and hands-on play are non-negotiable to stay up to date
  • Upgrade to access newer capabilities like GPT-4 Vision and actually experiment (e.g. photographing food to assess it)
  • Like the mobile wave a decade ago, failing to explore AI properly will leave you behind

so like my advice to people is you've got to try You' got to set aside the time or it'll pass you by

Paul Adams · 19:00

if people don't explore AI properly it it will leave them behind

Paul Adams · 19:30
#ai#learning#productivity#advice
Takeaway21:00

Go Back to Basics: Map What Your Product Does Against What AI Can Do

Rather than getting sidetracked by cool AI tech, Adams advises starting from the core premise of your product — what problem it solves and why people love it — then asking whether AI can do that. For some products AI is a full replacement, for others augmentation, and mapping product jobs against AI capabilities (write, summarize, answer queries, scan images, take actions) tells you where you sit relative to the 'meteor.'

  • Start from the product's core premise, not the shiny technology
  • Ask whether AI can do the job fully, partially, or not yet
  • AI can write, summarize, answer queries, find facts, scan text and images, and increasingly take actions
  • Any product with a workflow (most B2B SaaS) or multimedia is 'in the meteor's path'

I'd start with uh the thing your product does like what's the core premise behind it why do people use it you know what problem…

Paul Adams · 21:30
#ai#product-strategy#framework#b2b-saas
Takeaway36:30

Don't Bolt AI On — Have Everyone Learn It

Drawing a direct parallel to the mobile wave (when the mobile team was a marginalized side group nobody believed in), Adams warns against treating AI as a separate bolted-on team. Beyond deep ML specialists, Intercom tries to have everyone learn about AI, reflecting his broader belief in generalists who can pick up new things.

  • Mobile was once dismissed as a small side team — a warning against marginalizing AI the same way
  • You still need great ML engineers as a deep specialism to build truly great things
  • But don't isolate AI in a dedicated team; have everyone learn about it
  • Adams is a strong believer in generalists and setting teams up that way

what we're trying not to do is have like the the kind of like AI inbox team who and they're the only people who work…

Paul Adams · 38:00
#ai#team-structure#generalists#leadership
Takeaway48:30

Deliberately Read the AI Skeptics to Balance Your Optimism

Adams admits he's a 'delusionally optimistic' thinker who has jumped on bandwagons before, so he deliberately reads people who are skeptical of AI or think it's bad for humanity. Seeking out the alternative opinion is his way of balancing optimism with negativity and avoiding another wrong bandwagon.

  • He's been guilty of jumping on wrong bandwagons in the past
  • He notably never bought crypto and questions what web3 even was
  • He now reads skeptics and people who think the technology is dangerous
  • The goal is to balance his natural optimism with counterweight negativity

and I try these days to read the alternative opinion uh people who are skeptical or or think it's bad

Paul Adams · 49:00

I'm kind of a delusionally optimistic thinker so I try and balance that with negativity

Paul Adams · 49:30
#ai#critical-thinking#learning#advice
Takeaway75:30

Two Mottos on a Monitor Post-it: 'Only Work on What Matters Most'

Adams keeps two mottos on a post-it stuck over the bottom of his monitor so he's forced to look at them: 'only work on what matters most' and 'stop worrying about things you can't control.' They lower his temperature when he wakes up to a stressful email and stop him firing off dumb, red-energy replies.

  • He physically covers monitor real estate with the post-it so he can't ignore it
  • Motto one: only work on what matters most
  • Motto two: stop worrying about things you can't control
  • He links the second to Seven Habits' circles of control and influence

only work what matters most stop worry things you can't control it just like reduces the temperature

Paul Adams · 76:30
#productivity#focus#mottos#self-management